Electronic rust prevention

[65muzzy]

Hi all. Has anyone used or are using an electronic rust prevention system on their car. If so does it work and what brand are you using, etc. Thanks in advance.

[tim_morrison82]

can i add, would this help keep blasted unprotected steel rust free?

and doesn't electrolosis promote rusting? would this mean that the body would have to be completely rust free to stop it rusting faster?

[hybrid]

According to this fellow, it doesn't work.

http://www.corrosion-doctors.org/Car/ca ... c-rust.htm

Personally, I think if it worked and it was that cheap, everyone would be using it.

[65muzzy]

[quote="tim_morrison82"]can i add, would this help keep blasted unprotected steel rust free?

I think in theory the extra electrons by this process is supposed to stop corrossion. This is why im asking the question if these devices actually work.

[S[_]SPECT]

I'd also be very reluctant to try it if you had alloy heads or radiator...

[xpconnor]

Don't waste your money on it. They don't work. Not unless you keep your car submerged in an electrolytic solution, like the sea.

[shane427]

There is no reason it wouldnt work, haven't looked into the details of the car system, but they use the princple of a sacrificial anode across many areas. Quite a few corrosion engineers at work actually...working on ships, platforms etc etc.

The trick would be creating a suitable environment such that the anode would oxidise before the car....especially finding an electrolyte ...hmmm.

The princple is simply a transfer of electrons, where the metal that has the lowest ionization energy (energy required to add electrons) oxidises (anode) and the other reduces (cathode).

So just add magnesium or similar anode with an electolyte (transfers electrons) and it will oxidise preferential to your beautiful car....

or just keep out of the rain

[HappyOne]

Guys,

I can testify that the one I had on my Pajero 1997 model did work and was worth every penny $500.00 bucks at the time for the beach pack model.

This model that I used consisted of 8 electronic patches placed over the chassis front to back. We had that car all over Frazer Island a couple of times every year and the other odd trip on other beaches throughout northern NSW and Queensland.

The person who recently brought that car off me, was very surprised as “NO” rust was in the car despite the beach work it had over that time.

It greatly depends on a few key factors though:

1. The car needs to be rust free to begin with. Ours was near new at the time of installation.

2. Obviously you don’t drive directly in salt water if possible.

3. Cleaning the car properly and sticking a soaker hose under the car for 30-40 minutes was a must.

As far as installing them on an older car, well I’m still going to stick one on mine anyway as I think it might avoid any rust getting any worst. But I’ll still put the beach pack on it as I’m told that’s the better way to go.

And just as it happens, one of my ex work buddies is now a state manager for one of those electronic rust device suppliers he's going to look after me.

If anyone is after some further info, I could get some literature on them, just let me know what it is you want to know about them

Ed

[donoauto]

Don't waste your money on it. They don't work. Not unless you keep your car submerged in an electrolytic solution, like the sea.

Agreed , most on the market rely on vehicle being moist. I personally sell & have used for last 6 years, the "Couplertec" unit that was derived from R.O.D.E. in the US. You always here horror stories about these things , but my WRX has proved to me that it works ( the couplertec unit, that is) as it had a rusty spot where a boot lid rubber stopper rubbed through the paint. After 6 years of being parked in the weather , 2km's as the crow flies from the ocean , no further rusting of that area nor elsewhere. Paint is also gleaming as it also helps reduce oxidation of paintwork.
I am DEFINITELY putting another one on my Mustang as soon as I have the spare dolleria.
As far as I understand , it doesn't stop rust forever but it dramatically slows the process down to a crawl. As for a bare metal car , any areas of bare metal receive a light covering of surface rust but that's as far as it goes - so really not suitable for that. Being in a small town , I get to see/hear about customers cars that I have fitted these to & so far so good!
Even local panelbeater started sending them around about 5 years ago as he also proved they work.
Again , not an end all be all , but better be safe than sorry!

[shane427]

Arhh, uni is coming back to me.

If you add a voltage greater then that produced by the oxidation/reduction reaction you can reduce (or stop) the rate of the reaction (i.e. rate of corrosion)

Fairly certain a DC current is required??

[nassi]

I dont have one but see no reason why it wont work. It is really just another form of cathodic protection I think. This is what is used to protect LNG, water and probably many other pipelines.
I feel the theory is sound but as always it may be the application that lets it down.
jm2b
cheers

[Shaunp]

Cars don't rust if you treat them well. My Landrover Disco, is now 15 years old, I know the skins are alloy but the rest is steel, it lives out side under a shade sail, 2km from Morten bay, tows boats, goes up the beach, you name it. It was rust proofed with Valvoline Tectyl from new, and I've redone it twice since. Apart from that and Meguries polish, that's it. No rust at all. The under side I sprayed with Tectyle mixed 4:1 with black quick dry enamel.

[xpconnor]

I stole this off another forum but it explains why these rust gizmos don't work much better then I could myself. Sorry it is so long. If you still won't to cough up the dough after reading this then that is your choice. Just remember that there is a reason no car manufacturer in the world (that I know of) uses any of these items, much like those magical fuel saving devices. Not trying to be a smart arse, I just hate seeing people get ripped off by smooth salesmen.

The reason why this thing won't work on a car that's above ground is that there's no circuit between the sacrificial/impressed current anode and almost all of the rustable parts of the car. The conductive tape that you stick the anode(s) in place with means they'll protect the metal right under them just fine, but, y'know, paint'll do that too.

Passive galvanic cathodic protection (your standard "sacrificial anode" system, like when they bolt chunks of magnesium to ships below the waterline) and active impressed current cathodic protection (as used for underground pipelines and other Big Things where there's a long and lousy current path between the anodes and the metal they're protecting) both rely on the fact that the things they're protecting are lumps of metal surrounded by an electrolyte - water or earth.

Iron and steel rust essentially by forming tiny electrochemical cells anywhere that water and oxygen can get to the metal. Zero humidity air: No rust. Iron in a big box full of humid nitrogen: No rust. Iron submerged in salty water that's got no dissolved oxygen in it (which can almost be the case, deep in the ocean): No rust.

The particular curse of iron is that its rust is flaky, so more metal is continuously exposed to the air. Aluminium is much more reactive than iron and corrodes much faster, but its oxide forms a hard thin layer over the rest of the metal and protects it - if something doesn't cut the oxide layer, almost all of the metal survives indefinitely.

To protect flaky-rusting metal like iron, you attach a more reactive metal to it, applying current if necessary to boost the electrochemical path from the iron through the surrounding electrolyte to the sacrificial anode, which corrodes away instead of the iron.

You can demonstrate this effect yourself at home, quite easily; in a bucket of salty water, immerse one "tin" can (which'll actually be made out of steel these days; "tinfoil" was originally tin as well, before aluminium became cheap) and one otherwise identical can with a chunk of magnesium attached to it. Lightweight metal pencil sharpeners are cheap, and for some reason are made from a magnesium alloy, as everybody who had a cool science teacher in high school should already know.

Any way of attaching the magnesium that gives it metal-to-metal contact to the can will do - not glue, but just tying it on with some steel wire would do.

Can A will rust. Can B should remain pristine, while the sharpener slowly disappears. If you leave it long enough, the magnesium will vanish entirely, and then Can B will rust.

Try the same stunt with the two cans just sitting outdoors exposed to the elements, though, and the piece of Can B right under the sharpener will stay unrusted, while the rest of it rusts as normal, because there's no surrounding electrolyte. Rain will form a current path from the magnesium to the steel for a short distance around the sharpener, but most of the can will be unprotected most of the time, and applying a voltage to it won't help

[hybrid]

Yep, that was my understanding of it all too.

You need a path to ground to complete the process.
Something that your car sitting on rubber tyres does not have.

It works in the marine environment because they have that path to ground through the salt water.

And yes, DC current is required, because AC switches polarity.

[nassi]

Well there you go, I thought that humid air would provide the electrolyte required, but obviously not.
cheers